“It doesn’t affect me, so if it affects you, fuck you, I don’t give a fuck.”

A PR fixing all those issues was merged.

They used “they” when referring to a person, and “it” when referring to a process (the author used “he” when referring to a process calling another process, when he should have used “it.”)

I’ve seen some inclusive tech docs in which they (ha!) use “she” instead of “he” or “they.” I thought that was cool.

Are people writing “she” instead of “they” misogynistic and transphobic too?

People don’t need to build model trains either.

The project started as a hobby. People can do what they want with their free time.

I like operating systems as boring as possible. Let it manage the underlying system while I focus on work. I think you just convinced me to try Arch now.

Thanks for the insight.

You’re comparing board game companies with a laptop manufacturing company, right?

A company manufacturing a laptop like the Framework laptop is not just sourcing parts and assembling them together. There’s a LOT of work put in it, way more than some board game.

Their laptop costs in the thousands, and given their (so far) niche market, I can see why it isn’t feasible for them to give away these expensive to manufacture machines to community ambassadors.

And how much do these products you’re an ambassador of cost?

And are these new start-ups, or mega-companies?

Why spread a good thing to the world? Just let people enjoy their wiretappy thing… jesus christ.

Alright, bro. Let’s leave it at this point, then.

I’ll just add that I do agree with you in many aspects. Welcoming nazis to a community, closeted or not, is bullshit. I would never do that. I would uproot those motherfuckers and kick them out for good.

I just don’t think that Vaxry is one of them - maybe he is one by association, as in “you welcome nazis? Then you’re one!” But from where I am standing, he’s just a privileged moron who thinks that life is simpler than what it really is.

You’ll find many variations of it if you search for that phrase on the internet.

But at this point, eh, it’s not as fitting as I thought it would be.

There are only so many ways “I don’t care if Hitler is active in my community as long as he doesn’t talk about the gassing in my discord” can be interpreted

That’s exactly what he is saying. I don’t agree with it, but if you read his stuff, you can tell that it’s pedantry rather than hate what makes him say that.

and “I just want to code” is not one of them.

That’s your opinion, and we’re going in circles.

For starters, the practical issues of moderation and whether he wants to do it are never relevant to his argument throughout the blog post.

But they are, though.

He’s saying that “we should not care about people’s political views on a community unrelated to politics, as long as they do not use it to spread their agenda”. The words “we”, “should”, and “care” are pretty clear. This is a moral statement.

Moral or pragmatic, sure, whatever you say. But the base is not standing on hate. Just… Apathetic practicality? Laziness?

There are many more quotes that make it clear he is not talking about moderating his own community. His point about Hitler is clearly used to demonstrate his thoughts on how communities in general should be run, and why FOSS communities are getting it wrong.

We don’t disagree here. But so what? You could also say “fascist shouldn’t exist,” and someone somewhere will say that you’re condoning genocide.

Bonus points for explicitly listing LGBT issues as a topic one might disagree with.

You’re not saying anything we haven’t discussed already - we’ve the term transphobia several times already.

It’s all unambiguous. Vaxry is at no point talking about the practicalities of keeping Hitler out of his community. He is explaining why he thinks Hitler should be welcome into his community and the FOSS community in general, just as long as he doesn’t use these communities to further his goal of gassing people.

Exactly. We’re going in circles here. You’re attributing malice to this sentence. You’re saying that he is secretly saying “hurr hurr I am a nazi and this is how I get away with it.” He isn’t. I don’t like it, I fucking hate nazis. But I don’t think he is one. He’s probably autistic before being a nazi.

If there was ever any confusion over whether Vaxry doesn’t care about the toxicity or just can’t deal with it, this blog post definitely clears it up. He doesn’t care. He’s welcoming evil and harmful people in his community and in all communities and he takes a stance against the people who have an issue with this.

Correct. More of the same.

Your interpretation doesn’t work unless you ignore all the words he uses, the logic of his arguments, and even the fucking title.

It does work.

The only thing I’ve seen him say on the incident of harassing a trans person by editing their profile to change their pronouns is that it was “unprofessional”.

Because it was unprofessional from his point of view. He’s not secretly and deliberately condoning transphobia.

Ah yes, seeking people to harm because of their race and innate characteristics and banning people from your platform because of their morals and behavior. Equally bad things. I see the rights and wrongs of both sides now.

Again, we don’t disagree. I should have that phrase stored somewhere, ready to be pasted when discussing with you.

Look, show me a picture of him doing the nazi salute or protesting a pride parade, and we’ll talk.

Otherwise, I stand by what I said. The dude is a dense moron. Not evil.

I think you’re attributing malice to something else. Bear with me while I point out these two things:

First, The tomatoes quote is a consequence of something he mentioned later:

I firmly believe that FOSS is literally for everyone.

And second, he goes on to write this:

It’s important to note that there are many people who disagree on topics like religion, economic systems, LGBT issues, geopolitics, and other. For whatever reasons they may, we still should not ostracize them as long as they can interact with the FOSS community in a respectful manner, without arguing about those issues in places not meant for such discussions.

Here’s what I think: The dude is dogmatically dense. Not a literal nazi or transphobe. His response about moderation is part of that. “Ugh, I just want to code, not to babysit. If no one is spewing hate in my turf, they are welcome.” And even though I don’t agree with his stance, I still think he has a point: extremes are bad. And if the far-right is bad (“you’re either with us or against us; death to you!”), the far-left is bad too (“you’re either with us or against us; cancelled!”)

I’ve been there. Even after explaining that I was a transgender rights ally and supporter, and asked a question about sports - a question, as in I was trying to get myself informed, this one mod lashed out at me as if I was the devil, simply because my views didn’t perfectly align with hers before getting answers. It really caught me off guard. And she wouldn’t budge. It’s either her view or “pure unadulterated transphobia,” which I found ridiculous. That’s extreme.

But I’m capable of trying to reach to a middleground, whereas Vaxry stays firm - and that’s fine. Don’t like it? Don’t participate in his community! But don’t demonize him for some imaginary intentions you’re placing on him.

Aw, man. I think Vaxry’s got entrapped here.

He is saying that if nothing can sway you from an opinion, then it is a belief, including being 100% opposed to genocide.

(Please note: I don’t side with genocide!!! But I understand his point. Read on.)

I think he’s the positions armchair arguing type, not necessarily the evil type.

I can totally see him say “If a group of people’s solely reason to exist is to exterminate the rest of the human race, if that’s all they think about, if all they do is to accomplish that - induce terror, kill babies, spew propaganda, castrate humans of all races; then it’s safe to say that that group of people should not exist and it should be exterminated.”

That’s an extremely wild scenario, of course! But I think that’s what this guy is saying. We may find genocide in general heinous, but he won’t say that all genocides are bad because of thought examples like the above one.

Then the other party takes that personally, and extrapolates that Vaxry is in favor of exterminating all trans people - something he didn’t say or mean.

My two cents.

I don’t know, man. I read Vaxry’s response and I think that he has a point. There was an incident, and it was dealt with.

Then someone from redhat (because they e-mailed him with from RedHat address) told him “hey we saw improvements on you moderating your community. Great! But if you break our CoC again, we’ll ban you!” To which he replied “Uh, we don’t have a CoC, we don’t belong to your organization, what’s is this about?” And the person replied “This is not a RedHat position. And again, we’ll ban you!”

He explained this in a blogpost and posted the full e-mail conversation.

He also said that the misrepresentation got to such point that a another transgender coder made a contribution to Vaxry’s project, expecting that it would be rejected, and got surprised that her PR got merged.

I’d say, read Hyprland’s responses linked elsewhere in this thread before making any hasty decisions.

It seems (but I’m not sure, to be clear), that it was a situation that got solved, and people are still hung up on it.

It’s like that “but you fuck one sheep” joke.

It seems like the guy is being genuine here. Or was that pure PR?

its* origin

Yes.

Heh. “A couple of years ago.”